March 14, 2011

The coming of the Greeks to Provence and Corsica (King et al. 2011)

I am sure I will have much more to say on this paper once I read it carefully, but, for the moment, I will remind readers of my 2008 post on Expansion of E-V13 explained in which I postulated that E-V13 in Europe is attributed largely to Greek colonization.

The paper is also quite exciting as it includes samples of Greeks from the vicinity of Smyrna and Phocaia, the first, as far as I know published samples of Greek men from Asia Minor. I do find, however, somewhat bizarre the use of Anatolian Greeks as the putative ancestors of the colonization of the West Mediterranean and of Anatolian Turks as the supposed representatives of the Neolithic population (Table 1). The claim that the latest Anatolian population stratum (Turks) can be linked to its earliest (Neolithic-era Anatolians) is rather suspect.

UPDATE I (Mar 15)

The authors claim:
This high frequency ofhaplogroup J2a-Page55 (formerly DYS413≤ 18) in Smyrna is characteristic of non Greek Anatolia.
This claim is based entirely on the authors' limited Balkan Greek samples. An inspection of more Greek samples shows that DYS413 less or equal to 18 occurs at higher frequencies both in Crete, but also several mainland sites (Serrai, Larisa, Patrai) spanning the entire country. Hence, I believe that the claim that J2a-Page55 distinguishes Greeks from non-Greeks is spurious.

UPDATE II (Mar 15)

The authors cite the "Phoenician" paper:
Previous Y-chromosome genetic studies of Phoenician colonization have demonstrated that haplogroup J2 frequency was amplified in regions containing the Phoenician colonies of Iberia and North Africa in comparison to areas not containing Phoenician colonies [7]
My scathing criticism of that paper, and the specific "Phoenician" association with J2 can be found here.

UPDATE III (Mar 15)

The authors make a big deal of the presumed relationship of Phocaea with Ionians and of Smyrna with Ionian/Aeolians. As I have mentioned before, it is a hard sell to think that two sites right next to each other, inhabited by people who had no ethnic or religious distinction for more than 2,000 years (any tribal Greek identities had disappeared by ancient times) managed to retain, nonetheless distinctive gene pools from each other over that time span that can be traced to archaic Greek tribal distinctions.

UPDATE (Mar 17)

The above-mentioned nitpicks do not, however, detract from the paper's thesis. So, it's worth repeating a few of the things on which this thesis is supported:
  • We have new Greek population samples from Asia Minor that show E-V13 frequencies well within the regional variation of mainland Greece, and higher than in the Turkish Anatolian population. This disproves the theory that E-V13 may have been introduced to the mainland Greek population recently from Albanians, Thracians, and other bizarre theories advocated by some, as these would not have affected substantially the Greeks of West Asia Minor.
  • It should be noted however, that E-V13 frequencies vary substantially among Greek populations. This seems consistent with my theory of its Bronze Age "heroic" origin, as late lineages are expected to have non-homogeneous frequency distributions.
  • The Corsican evidence is consistent with the Greek origin of E-V13 due to the higher frequency of E-V13 around the colony of Alalia (4.6% East Corsica vs. 1.6% in West Corsica).
  • The absence of I-M423 in Provence precludes a substantial contribution to the Provencal population by Balkan populations north of Greece where I-M423 reaches a higher frequency.
It seems pretty clear to me that E-V13 bearing men of Provence are patrilineally descended from the Greeks of the archaic age. The same could be true for others (e.g., J-M92) assigned (erroneously in my opinion) to non-Greek Anatolians, but overall, the evidence supports the persistence of the gene pool of the Western Greeks among the present-day southern French.

BMC Evolutionary Biology 2011, 11:69doi:10.1186/1471-2148-11-69

The coming of the Greeks to Provence and Corsica: Y-chromosome models of archaic Greek colonization of the western Mediterranean

Roy J King et al.

Abstract (provisional)

Background
The process of Greek colonization of the Central and Western Mediterranean during the Archaic and Classical Eras has been understudied from the perspective of population genetics. To investigate the Y chromosomal demography of Greek colonization in the Western Mediterranean, Y-chromosome data consisting of 29 YSNPs and 37 YSTRs were compared from 51 subjects from Provence, 56 subjects from Smyrna and 31 subjects whose paternal ancestry derives from Asia Minor Phokaia, the ancestral embarkation port to the 6th century BCE Greek colonies of Massalia (Marseilles) and Alalie (Aleria, Corsica).

Results
19% of the Phokaian and 12% of the Smyrnian representatives were derived for haplogroup E-V13, characteristic of the Greek and Balkan mainland, while 4% of the Provencal, 4.6% of West Corsican and 1.6% of East Corsican samples were derived for E-V13. An admixture analysis estimated that 17% of the Y-chromosomes of Provence may be attributed to Greek colonization. Using putative Neolithic Anatolian lineages: J2a-dys445=6, G2a-M406 and J2a1b1-M92 the data predict a 0% Neolithic contribution to Provence from Anatolia. Estimates of colonial Greek vs. indigenous Celto-Ligurian demography predict a maximum of a 10% Greek contribution, suggesting a Greek male elite-dominant input into the Iron Age Provence population.

Conclusions
Given the origin of viniculture in Provence is ascribed to Massalia, these results suggest that E-V13 may trace the demographic and socio-cultural impact of Greek colonization in Mediterranean Europe, a contribution that appears to be considerably larger than that of a Neolithic pioneer colonization.

Link

27 comments:

AK said...

"I do find, however, somewhat bizarre the use of Anatolian Greeks as the putative ancestors of the colonization of the West Mediterranean

Per Wiki, and also Herodotus (IIRC) the colonization of Massilia came from Phocaea. However, his description of the colonization of Anatolian Ionia suggests that the actual source of the colonists there was all over, everyone counting as "Ionians" as long as they "swore the oath" at Athens before starting out. If an analogous process occurred in colonizing Massilia, colonists could well have included Dorians, Aeolians, Lydians, Carians, and who knows what else.

Dienekes said...

What is bizarre is the use of Anatolian Turks as representative of the Neolithic.

Time-ordered, the peoples in question are:

1 Neolithic Anatolians
2 Ancient Greek Anatolians
3 Modern Greek Anatolians
4 Modern Turkish Anatolians

I don't see any reason in this time sequence to link 4 with 1.

Annie Mouse said...

If J2 and G2 represent the neolithic then the case for neolithic genetic replacement is lost. Germany for example has 2.5% J2 and known neolithic settlements.

Greece and Albania are almost identical in Y chromosomes. The difference is that J2 and G2 (and R1a) are higher in Greece than in Albania. If Albania was populated from Greece this suggests to me that extra J2 and G2 (and R1a) entered Greece after the split. Evidence of more recent population flow it appears, perhaps from Turkey and the Balkans. Perhaps flowing deeper into southern Europe in more recent times.

Gioiello said...

I haven’t yet had the time to read the paper, but ,watching the diagrams, I, that have always refused the Aegean origin of Etruscans, had to say that it is more likely that the inhabitants of Alalia (where Etruscans defeated Greeks) and of South France, which has had a massive Italian (above all Tuscan) immigrations, are of Etruscan/Asian descent more than Greek.

DagoRed said...

The Turks may be the Greek turkish speakers,in fact, I believe, that this is the link.

About Provence, I think it's fair enough connection to the Greek colonization. Marseille has always been a Greek city which came in the Roman domains such as Roman allied city and has never undergone large massacres during the dark times.
But I believe that the spread of E-V13 is not only of Greek origin.
The Gallia Narbonensis was heavily settled in Roman times (the Romans called it "our Province, "or simply "the Province", and today his name is still Provence), and many cities in the region were founded by veterans of the legions (Nimes, Narbonne, Orange, Arles, Beziers, Frejus) so I think that the during the imperial era the influx of people from the Balkans, Italy and Greece itself was significant.

About Corsica however, it seems strange that the spread of E-V13 is more consistent on the west coast, when Aleria, the largest Greek colony was situated on the coast of north-east and the city was abandoned in the fifth century BC.
I believe that for this reason that it is modern and is connected to the settlement of the Greeks fleeing from the Ottomans in 1600, when the Genoese ruled the island.
They settled in Cargese, in the region of Ajaccio, in the south west.

Dean said...

"Greece and Albania are almost identical in Y chromosomes. The difference is that J2 and G2 (and R1a) are higher in Greece than in Albania. If Albania was populated from Greece this suggests to me that extra J2 and G2 (and R1a) entered Greece after the split. Evidence of more recent population flow it appears, perhaps from Turkey and the Balkans. Perhaps flowing deeper into southern Europe in more recent times."

I don't have the data in front of me, but I believe more of J2 in Greece is near the coasts. If that's the case, then it's possible that these Greeks are descendants of ancient peoples, before more modern gene flow. Greeks controlled the economic strongholds during pre-Turkish invasions--this included large cities and coasts.

Parts of the interior of Greece were said to be repopulated with Greeks by the Byzantines over 1,000 years ago.

Erik said...

Annie Mouse, the J2 in Germany is 5% not 2.5%

Gioiello said...

Probably the paper hasn’t demonstrated its assumptions, but has put at our disposal many interesting haplotypes. Amongst the R-M269 from Smyrna and Phocaea (23) 6 have DYS385=11-11. Argiedude was the first to speak of a Balkan haplotype of R1b1b2a (now R1b1a2a), found also in Ciulla, a Sicilian of probably Arberesh origin. I think having demonstrated that the Balkan haplotype is very uniform and found in Italy an haplotype with more variance (Risso: ySearch EK3WY), then more ancient, and spoke of an Italian origin also for this haplotype. See now this haploype found in England (Beacham: ySearch TN2ZH), which demonstrates the origin of this cluster in Western Europe (I of course think in Italy) rather than in the Balkans.

argiedude said...

These samples are weird. If I had analyzed them without knowing their origin I would've sworn they're from Greece, Albania, or Macedonia.

argiedude said...

R1b1b2 - Albanian cluster. This cluster isn't formally recognized yet, it doesn't have its own SNP, but there's no doubt about its validity, it has one of the most easily recognizable and divergent modal haplotypes of any R1b1b2 cluster. 6 of the 89 Turkish samples in this study belonged to this cluster, or 7%. The cluster makes up 15% of Albania's y-dna, 4% of north Greece, 4% of south Greece, 0% in northeast Greece (the panhandle), 2% in Macedonia, 16% in south Serbia (Kosovo), 2% in central Serbia, 1% in Bulgaria, and 0% in Romania. In Italy there are 0 out of 1000 samples, in Croatia there a few out of 1250, and in Turkey there are 0 out of 1500 samples, underscoring the extremely limited range of the cluster. Yet this study found 6 out of 89 in northwest Turkey. Also, the 6 samples of this study have a low diversity, which is normal for this cluster, but not an ultralow diversity indicating a very recent "Ashkenazi-style" bottleneck.

argiedude said...

The study found M78+ V13+, aka E1b1b1a2b, at a whopping 13 out of 89, or 15%. Incredible. V13+ is also centered in Albania. It's found in Turkey at barely 1%, at 7% in Greece, 6% to 8% in south to north Italy, and 25% in Albania (this last figure calculated with just 50 samples).

argiedude said...

This is so strange, I think we either have a huge sampling mistake, for example, they mistakenly analyzed a set of Balkan samples instead of the intended northwest Turkey samples, and if not, then this is a very interesting discovery that requires further investigation.

Dienekes said...

The study found M78+ V13+, aka E1b1b1a2b, at a whopping 13 out of 89, or 15%. Incredible. V13+ is also centered in Albania. It's found in Turkey at barely 1%, at 7% in Greece, 6% to 8% in south to north Italy, and 25% in Albania (this last figure calculated with just 50 samples).

Your numbers are both unattributed and erroneous; All Greek studied populations have higher than the made-up 7% figure.

Quadruple-posting and misleading with made-up numbers is not good behavior.

Annie Mouse said...

Yep sorry typo. 4.5% J2

Strat said...

Coastal West Anatolia (the tested area in this study) received migrants from the Greek mainland not only during Ancient times but also during the Ottoman era. In fact, coastal West Anatolian Greeks are overwhelmingly descended from the Ottoman era Orthodox Christian migrants to the West Anatolian coast from the southern Balkans and the Aegean islands according to the historical demographic sources (the original coastal West Anatolian Greek population had mostly been absorbed by the Turks due to mass slavery and conversions mostly during the earlier Anatolian Turkish principilities era). So coastal West Anatolian Greeks are genetically the least Anatolian of all Anatolian Greeks.

Other Anatolian Greeks (who, unfortunately, weren't included in this study), including the Interior West Anatolian Greeks, on the other hand, are much less influenced by the Ottoman era Orthodox Christian migrations from the southern Balkans and the islands and thus much more indigenous to Anatolia.

Dienekes said...

Strat, you are right about gene flow to Asia Minor (mainly from the islands). But remember that the islands were also mostly settled by Ionians in ancient times, and before that we would expect the prehistoric population of the islands to be related to the coastal population of Asia Minor.

Another thing to remember is that the coastal Greeks had very little time to intermix with pre-Greek Anatolians at the time when Massalia was settled, so I don't think it would be a good idea to use Greeks from the interior, as these would have absorbed Mysians, Lydians and the like _after_ the Western colonization.

But, certainly, it's a good idea to look at more Greeks and likely Greek descendants from elsewhere. That's a good way to identify a small "core" of Greek lineages that are so omni-present from Massalia to the Black Sea, that they are likely to have been part of the ancient gene pool as well.

argiedude said...

After Dienekes pointed out to me, in his own special way, that 7% V13 in Greece is wrong, I looked at published studies and realized that in fact Greek V13 is more like 25%. My mistake was using ysearch samples. I'm now realizing that at least half of these samples are probably Jewish Greeks, and those that explicitly stated their Jewish origin indeed had an assortment of haplogroups that is not typical of Greece.

For Dienekes, aside from Cruciani-2007 (E3b study), King (2008), and Battaglia (2008), are there any other studies that tested V13 in Greeks?

Also, do you know from where in the Aegean are the "Aegean" samples in Cruciani's 2007 study of E3b?

argiedude said...

In yhrd there are 16 samples from Chios, the Greek island off the west coast of Turkey that is very nearby to Smyrna and Phokaia, the 2 west Turkish sites sampled in this study. 4 samples are probable M78, and given the fact that M78(xV13) is very low in both Greece and Turkey, it's fair to guess that probably all 4 are V13, which would result in 25% V13. Western Turkey, excluding these recent Smyrna and Phokaia samples, has about 3% V13, much lower than Greece's 25% V13. And I have to stress the fact that the Smyrna and Phokaia samples included 6 samples of "R1b1b2 - Albanian cluster", that really is the clincher that ties these samples to the Balkans. It's like finding 7% M222 in the coast of Germany.

terryt said...

"It seems pretty clear to me that E-V13 bearing men of Provence are patrilineally descended from the Greeks of the archaic age. The same could be true for others (e.g., J-M92) assigned (erroneously in my opinion) to non-Greek Anatolians"

That was my suspicion on first reading the paper. However I thought there may be some perfectly good reason why the haplogroups may be older in Provence.

anaveno said...

Cartledge says humorously perhaps with a note of whimsical frustration:
It has of late become an acknowledged scandal that the Dorians, archaeologically speaking, do not exist. That is, there is no cultural trait surviving in the material record for the two centuries or so after 1200 which can be regarded as a peculiarly Dorian hallmark. Robbed of their patents for Geometric pottery, cremation burial, iron-working and, the unkindest prick of all, the humble straight pin, the hapless Dorians stand naked before their creator - or, some would say, inventor.
Cartledge, Paul (2002). Sparta and Lakonia: A Regional History, 1300-362. Routledge. pp. 68.

Although the tribe of Dan settled the tel in the 11th century BCE, they did not leave any archeological remains.
The city became prominent only after the death of King Solomon (928 BCE) when Israel was divided into two kingdoms.


The coming of the Greeks to Provence and Corsica (King et al. 2011)????

Autochthonous (E-M81) and prominent (E-M78 and J-M267) Berber Y-chromosome lineages were detected...
Male and female sub-Saharan African genetic inputs were also detected....Fregel, R. et al. (2009), Demographic history of Canary Islands male gene-pool: replacement of native lineages by European, BMC Evolutionary Biology, vol. 9, article no.181 (3 Aug 2009).

Dienekes said...

For Dienekes, aside from Cruciani-2007 (E3b study), King (2008), and Battaglia (2008), are there any other studies that tested V13 in Greeks?

Di Giacomo et al. (2003) tested for DE but had large regional Greek samples, and most of it ought to be E-V13 given all the other evidence we have.

And I have to stress the fact that the Smyrna and Phokaia samples included 6 samples of "R1b1b2 - Albanian cluster", that really is the clincher that ties these samples to the Balkans.

I don't know what evidence there is for an "Albanian cluster", but the fact that it exists in Anatolian Greeks who most likely have no or minimal Albanian admixture probably suggests that it is a more general Balkan cluster rather than a specific Albanian one.

Also, I have no idea why you'd be surprised that these Greeks have Balkan connections, Greeks after all, originated in the Balkans and having moving back and forth across the Aegean for more than 3,000 years.

argiedude said...

The Albanian cluster of R1b1b2 has 385a/b = 11/11 and 459a/b = 8/10.

It's L11- but it has 393 = 13, though it does have 461 = 11, as in other L11- clusters.

Gioiello said...

Ciulla has been tested by 23andME and is on the “Adriano’s spreadsheet”. He has nothing different from me and the other R1b1b2a: L23+/L49+/L150+. Do you think that this cluster has an own SNP? Perhaps, but anyway not a subclade different from L277, M405 or my S136, i.e. this was the bush from where arose L51. The problem is to determine the ancientness of this cluster. You know I think that it is very old and linked with other haplotypes like that of the Italian Risso (ySearch EK3WJ). We shall see.

argiedude said...

Check this out:

V13 and R1b-Albanian cluster map

Note that the Albanian cluster has its highest frequency in the Penopolesse peninsula, at 35% (n=93).

Dienekes said...

The way that figure is labeled is impenetrable.

Note that the Albanian cluster has its highest frequency in the Penopolesse peninsula, at 35% (n=93).

Higher than in Albania itself? j/k

Gioiello said...

@ Argiedude

If a SNP for your “Albanian cluster” was found, I think you should take in consideration not only

Da Silveira (Brazil): 58HRZ: 13, 11-11, 16, 8-10,11

but also
Anonymous from Slovenia (Slovenia): B2A4W: 13, 11-11, 16, 8-11, 11
Anghel (Romania): SXRNE: 12, 11-11, 15, 8-9, 11
Yuran (Croatia): YARC5: 12, 11-11, 15, 9-10, 11
etc. etc.

applecat said...

A large part of the Penopolesse and part of Attica were settled by Albanians (Arvantes). This occurred around the 13/14th centuries at the request of the Byzantines.