tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post605234192185325105..comments2024-01-04T04:11:55.717+02:00Comments on Dienekes’ Anthropology Blog: Paleolithic Cretan sailorsDienekeshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02082684850093948970noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-84198089842487037142011-01-09T09:56:17.550+02:002011-01-09T09:56:17.550+02:00"The divide pretty much dates to the breakup ..."The divide pretty much dates to the breakup of Pangea". <br /><br />I searched around a bit and noticed it was 5 million years ago at least. However I also noticed that a fall in sea level would make Sicily much larger, especially to the south. This would bring the coast of Africa closer, although I don't know how much.terrythttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17327062321100035888noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-41487481609847609692011-01-08T01:26:57.227+02:002011-01-08T01:26:57.227+02:00"Does anyone know how much of a fall in sea l..."Does anyone know how much of a fall in sea level it would take to connect Sicily and Africa?"<br /><br />It would take less of a sea level drop to connect Sicily to Africa via Corsica and Elba and from their to either Gibralter or the Dardanelles, than it would to connect Sicily directly to Africa. I doubt that any hominin has ever lived in the Mediterranean or near it at a time when the two were connected directly by a land bridge. The divide pretty much dates to the breakup of Pangea.Andrew Oh-Willekehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02537151821869153861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-57863199151539222422011-01-07T09:06:39.679+02:002011-01-07T09:06:39.679+02:00Does anyone know how much of a fall in sea level i...Does anyone know how much of a fall in sea level it would take to connect Sicily and Africa? It occurred to me that if the Mediterranean became blocked ther the sea level in the eastern Mediterranean would fall considerably.terrythttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17327062321100035888noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-84347451128575135572011-01-07T00:46:27.844+02:002011-01-07T00:46:27.844+02:00Months ago, someone posed the same question about ...Months ago, someone posed the same question about the human presence in Sardinia during the same period, due to the discovery of tools, perhaps dated 150,000 BC<br />Difficult to say that may be true, because there are no objective facts, but you still keep the doubt, because at that time, the sea level was at least 100 meters lower and would not be difficult to reach the islands by land bridges .<br />Probably the Aegean islands were visible from each other and just a few hundred meters. Crete and Rhodes could be achieved through Karpatos. Sardinia by Elba and Corsica. Corsica and Sardinia were united, as Sicily was united with the mainland.<br />Everything has to be proven, of course, but best to leave the doubt.<br /><br />I found thi map of Italy in that age.<br /><br />http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_tsBtHLQS87o/S4vDSKuxcII/AAAAAAAAAnI/arsVejYZg1c/s1600/glaciazione.jpgAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-89091935234637807962011-01-06T07:47:01.095+02:002011-01-06T07:47:01.095+02:00I sincerely think we always tend to underestimate ...I sincerely think we always tend to underestimate the ability of ancient humankind. An estimated 790,000 years ago at Gesher Benot Ya'aqov in Israel is evidence of the first controlled use of fire. This profoundly changed a lot of things. All this time and nobody couldn't figure out how to cross a body of water by a large floating branch or fallen log??? Doubt it!<br /><br />Did they not have the ability to try and emulate creatures who live in the water or even swim under their own power? Someday we'll realize that it wasn't modern man that created the most profound of things that affect our lives to this very day. The crossing of water is not as difficult as everyone wants to make it out.<br /><br />ArchYeomanDroidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01611121652703582669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-19519475510022681162011-01-05T02:58:52.165+02:002011-01-05T02:58:52.165+02:00"I am finding it hard to accept the Paleolith..."I am finding it hard to accept the Paleolithic humans were capable of seafaring even over flat shallow seas using islands to hop to Crete". <br /><br />I am too. Especially seeing that humans didn't manage to reach most other Meditarranean islands, including many that were much closer to any mainland. <br /><br />"I'm inclined to be very skeptical, particularly in the absence of marked change in fauna in the fossil record upon Homo arrival". <br /><br />That's another aspect that promotes doubt. <br /><br />"it only has to happen once and isn't impossible". <br /><br />That could explain Flores as well. On Flores humans survived for some time but on Crete they failed, presumably indicating a fairly small group.terrythttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17327062321100035888noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-56924941240696530182011-01-04T16:23:46.887+02:002011-01-04T16:23:46.887+02:00"between 130,000 and 700,000 years old"
..."between 130,000 and 700,000 years old"<br /><br />Big difference. The low end could be first explorer modern humans or hybrid Neanderthals who had contact with the pre-Out of Africa group. But, 700,000 years old would be pre-Neanderthal. Also, query how the dates are established - I'm inclined to be very skeptical, particularly in the absence of marked change in fauna in the fossil record upon Homo arrival.<br /><br />Suppose it is true. Would the shortest distance really have been 40 miles at all times every single day in that entire period? If the distance were 30 miles or less, you would have had line of sight. Perhaps with low tides, a prolonged dought, and a temporary blockage in a source water body for the Mediterranean (perhaps a temporary glacial blockage as glaciers break up), it may have been shallow for weeks or days. I could also imagine a few Neanderthals caught in a tsunami grabbing some driftwood as it hits and paddling for dear life once they got close, catching the same currents together, and winding up in Crete accidentally. Unusual, even freaky, but it only has to happen once and isn't impossible.Andrew Oh-Willekehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02537151821869153861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-22199828632360250892011-01-04T15:29:24.797+02:002011-01-04T15:29:24.797+02:00Brumm et al.'s report in Nature last year on 1...Brumm et al.'s report in Nature last year on 1 million year-old stone tools from Flores' Soa Basin also indicates that early hominin dispersal across significant water barriers happens sometimes, SOMEHOW (!). Tsunami anyone?Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03419577907091553907noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-53165248488598718702011-01-04T12:43:59.457+02:002011-01-04T12:43:59.457+02:00Europe's most southerly point is the island of...Europe's most southerly point is the island of Gavdos which is part of Crete. Sailing, Paleolithic Age humans who settled on Crete's southern shore surely must have landed on Gavdos Island first if they came from the direction of the African mainland.<br /><br />There were Paleolithic humans living in Sicily. So how did they get there? Low sea level land connections to the mainland may have assisted in the colonization. I am finding it hard to accept the Paleolithic humans were capable of seafaring even over flat shallow seas using islands to hop to Crete.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com