tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post6349321098439437838..comments2024-01-04T04:11:55.717+02:00Comments on Dienekes’ Anthropology Blog: IBD sharing between Iberians and North Africans (Botigué et al. 2013)Dienekeshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02082684850093948970noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-29753145029699576932013-06-05T03:39:52.724+03:002013-06-05T03:39:52.724+03:00"European gene flow to North Africa: The last..."European gene flow to North Africa: The last of the Vandals {with an element of the Alans} disappeared among the Berbers after defeat by the Byzantines in 534 AD"<br /><br />Yet there are some very interesting hot spots of R1b in tribal Algeria (non-French). Possibly these were vestiges of Neolithic migrants on their way west? More study is needed in North Africa with much greater sampling. Mark Dhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03792117663748801194noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-32037616955335762702013-06-04T14:23:10.448+03:002013-06-04T14:23:10.448+03:00European gene flow to North Africa: The last of th...European gene flow to North Africa: The last of the Vandals {with an element of the Alans} disappeared among the Berbers after defeat by the Byzantines in 534 ADSgt. Gilhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16093774878169751410noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-70952353198459881072013-06-04T11:42:38.711+03:002013-06-04T11:42:38.711+03:00http://www.biomedcentral.com/1471-2148/10/237http://www.biomedcentral.com/1471-2148/10/237Robhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07166839601638241857noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-10691670796245088492013-06-04T11:41:54.484+03:002013-06-04T11:41:54.484+03:00A good paper looking at all marker systems was rec...A good paper looking at all marker systems was recently done by Currat et al Robhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07166839601638241857noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-29731734257616185552013-06-04T08:44:10.104+03:002013-06-04T08:44:10.104+03:00"The more plausible alternative, of course, w..."The more plausible alternative, of course, would not be flight but maritime travel". <br /><br />Of course. We can assume that the first immigrants into the Mediterranean islands were capable of reaching both Europe and North Africa. That alone would lead to considerable mixing of populations around the Mediterranean, including both the northern and southern coastline. terrythttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17327062321100035888noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-89926005066120022672013-06-04T02:22:58.319+03:002013-06-04T02:22:58.319+03:00No Sardinians and S.italians samples, useless stud...No Sardinians and S.italians samples, useless study.truthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08622344688109770244noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-83587154353528758622013-06-04T02:15:43.761+03:002013-06-04T02:15:43.761+03:00"Given that Iberia is the neighbor of NW Afri..."Given that Iberia is the neighbor of NW Africa one would not be surprised if there was gene flow in both directions, and while North Africa gene flow into Iberia is one possible explanation, some of the gene flow may have gone the other way"<br /><br />I would take this as a given. The historic references of conquests, migrations and back-migrations are too numerous to mention. I think Gibraltar has seen more movement of people than the Hellespont.Mark Dhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03792117663748801194noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-78772100665049120382013-06-04T01:31:17.543+03:002013-06-04T01:31:17.543+03:00Pity they did not analyze any northern West Asian ...Pity they did not analyze any northern West Asian population other than Cypriots, any population from the Caucasus, and any population from the Pontic steppe region. This deficiency affects their conclusions and their IBD sharing maps in a negative way.Onur Dincerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05041378853428912894noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7785493.post-21067640250853455432013-06-04T01:11:33.660+03:002013-06-04T01:11:33.660+03:00"It also makes sense, because of the limited ..."It also makes sense, because of the limited occurrence of Sub-Saharan markers in Iberia: such elements did not, presumably, fly over North Africa, but landed in Iberia via people who were themselves admixed."<br /><br />The more plausible alternative, of course, would not be flight but maritime travel. There are archaeologically attested Iberian contacts with the Canary Islands and Britain, which call for similar levels of maritime skill, quite far back in pre-history and sporadic population exchange with sub-Saharan African by peoples with such a long maritime tradition at any time in the prehistoric era or in unattested events in the early historic era (don't forget that Spain financed the tour of Columbus to the Americas and many other early maritime explorers) could easily lead to cryptic sub-Saharan ancestry in modern Iberian populations that would be indistinguishable from much earlier exchanges after fifteen or more generations in which introduced sub-Saharan African alleles could reach fixation.andrewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08172964121659914379noreply@blogger.com